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2021 RMax 2 Gray in Nova Scotia
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I'm the only one who brought up drivers door alignment. I'm a 32 yr helicopter guy and I notice stuff.
It works perfect btw, but doesn't look perfect.

Here's a pic of a 90k Tesla I took the other day.
That door is not lined up correctly either. Though I'm sure it works fine.

20201127_202206.jpg


I'm a slow typer. I was working on that way before your post. 馃榿

There is something more with the clutch weight wear. It's pretty rare and inconsistent. Kawi is replacing any with issues. There is no tank issue, shitty gauge, shitty vent, same as Yamaha. I did forget the driveshaft, edited OP. The door bushing is not a problem with bushings, but hinge tolerance. Someone made a shiny brass bushing and now everyone needs it. If you have that issue a washer will fix it or if you want to get real fancy a thicker bronze bushing for a buck at the hardware store. Don't forget there is thread on here bitching about Rmax door alignment also. Heat and noise are not an issue. I'm not real sure were you keep getting that one, I haven't seen it mentioned other than by people that put front and rear windows then wonder why it's hot. It is cooler and quieter than the YXZ(first gen), Gen 1 Wolverine and Can am X3. Those are the only machines I have enough summer ride time in to state that as fact.
 

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Yamaha doesn't have venting issues on the X series and know how to design a gas tank without a hump, throwing off the gas gauge (those are two issues and the first has plagued Kawasaki since the Teryx).
I could be wrong here but didn't the x series need the filter and vent extensions to keep fumes out of the cab and dust out of the tank like the gen 1 did? I've heard that the 49 state KRX was done away with for 21 and all KRX are now 50 state (CA) models. These are sealed loop and don't have a vent issue. I'm not sure if this info correct at or not. The vent issue is an EPA caused issue on all model's anyway and is a $5 ten minute fix on the KRX. Anyway nothing to do with reliability.

The hump in the tank is not the issue in most cases with the KRX gauge. It's a incorrectly bent float arm. You can bend the float and get it pretty accurate. Honestly mine is better then my gen1 with out touching it. Blaming the hump is easier then fixing it so Kawi blames the hump. It is a fail on there part. Either way both gen 1's and YXZ's in our group have/had worthless fuel gauges. I just fuel every time we are at camp or every 100 miles, I'm used to not paying any attention to the gauge from my gen 1 anyway. Again, nothing to do with reliability.

According to VForce John, the premature wear problem isn't random or rare but inevitable until it's fixed. That's why he's not offering clutching yet.
My understanding of the clutch issue is the weights get grooves in them causing a hang, that causes a shifting feeling. If that is run to long it wears grooves in the sheave because the belt is running in the same spot when the weight gets hung up. What is not clear is why some machines have the issue in a few hundred miles and others go thousands. I'll be talking with John in the next few days anyway and will get his take on it.

How many bitched about the door alignment issue and how easily is that fixed? I have front windshield and rear screen and have ZERO heat problems. Majority of RMAX owners will tell you they don't have a heat problem. On my FB group I have former KRX owners who jumped to the RMAX and compared to the RMAX the KRX heat and noise are a problem.
On the door issue, I'm not real sure which unit your your referring to but I will say percentage wise very few on either model and the fix is very simple on either model. Personally I wouldn't call it a issue but you brought it up so I responded.

We will just have to agree to disagree on the heat issue. The majority of KRX owners will tell you the same thing. I also wouldn't put cab heat or door alignment in a reliability issue category.


Once again, I place engineering folly much higher on the SNAFU scale than manufacturing defects and human error on the assembly line. Most of Kawasaki's problems are engineering-related and most of Yamaha's problems are some idiot on the assembly line.
I pretty much think both of them are pretty shitty, but at least a design flaw can fixed with 100% certainty. Yamaha seems blame most all the major issues on line workers. Maybe they need to step up their QC.
 

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I could be wrong here but didn't the x series need the filter and vent extensions to keep fumes out of the cab and dust out of the tank like the gen 1 did? I've heard that the 49 state KRX was done away with for 21 and all KRX are now 50 state (CA) models. These are sealed loop and don't have a vent issue. I'm not sure if this info correct at or not. The vent issue is an EPA caused issue on all model's anyway and is a $5 ten minute fix on the KRX. Anyway nothing to do with reliability.

The hump in the tank is not the issue in most cases with the KRX gauge. It's a incorrectly bent float arm. You can bend the float and get it pretty accurate. Honestly mine is better then my gen1 with out touching it. Blaming the hump is easier then fixing it so Kawi blames the hump. It is a fail on there part. Either way both gen 1's and YXZ's in our group have/had worthless fuel gauges. I just fuel every time we are at camp or every 100 miles, I'm used to not paying any attention to the gauge from my gen 1 anyway. Again, nothing to do with reliability.

My understanding of the clutch issue is the weights get grooves in them causing a hang, that causes a shifting feeling. If that is run to long it wears grooves in the sheave because the belt is running in the same spot when the weight gets hung up. What is not clear is why some machines have the issue in a few hundred miles and others go thousands. I'll be talking with John in the next few days anyway and will get his take on it.

On the door issue, I'm not real sure which unit your your referring to but I will say percentage wise very few on either model and the fix is very simple on either model. Personally I wouldn't call it a issue but you brought it up so I responded.

We will just have to agree to disagree on the heat issue. The majority of KRX owners will tell you the same thing. I also wouldn't put cab heat or door alignment in a reliability issue category.

I pretty much think both of them are pretty shitty, but at least a design flaw can fixed with 100% certainty. Yamaha seems blame most all the major issues on line workers. Maybe they need to step up their QC.
No that was the Gen1 and Viking.

You said yourself that with a windshield and back window heat becomes a problem on the KRX. That's not a problem with the RMAX. Only heat 'problem' with the RMAX is if your day consists of 5-10 MPH constant speed which I don't think many will experience. Sure you may go that speed encountering a tough obstacle, but not the whole day's ride. That 'problem' is probably applicable to every SxS model on the market.

Yamaha isn't blaming anyone, they don't make statements like that. It's us end users that make that statement. Design flaw usually affects 100% of the vehicles and takes much longer to fix vs firing a bad employee.
 

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I didn't say it's a problem. I said that is the only complaints I've heard. I've never tried running both, so I cant commit about it. I can tell you that you are much more "in" the krx and there is not a lot of airflow in the cab even with just a half windshield. I can light a cigarette at 30 mph.

Either way it still has nothing to do with reliability.
 

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NEWS FLASH! All side by sides are Junk in quality when compared to automotive. They are all built at a price point with engineering designs taking in account to match those price points. They all could build a much better more reliable machine but we wouldn't pay for it as the volume sold couldn't justify the cost to build it to be profitable. The reality is as long as its safe its good enough. Most people sell their off road toys before they ever hit 5000 miles on them. How reliable do they really need to make them? Also, we the owners, are probably more to blame on most problems than the manufacturer. We beat the heck out of these things and complain if they brake, Ride, Repair, Repeat is the process for off road vehicles. Some are better than others, no doubt, but pretty much the higher the performance the more work its going to require to maintain. Manufactures are better off pushing the envelope of features and performance to get sales than they are to worry about quality (Polaris business model). Honda use to worry and still do to some point about building high quality first but they always suffered in performance because of it and lost sales.

If we built a list like OP stated it would be very long list and it would look like they all are junk. Pick what features are most important to you and deal with the negatives.
 

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NEWS FLASH! All side by sides are Junk in quality when compared to automotive. They are all built at a price point with engineering designs taking in account to match those price points. They all could build a much better more reliable machine but we wouldn't pay for it as the volume sold couldn't justify the cost to build it to be profitable. The reality is as long as its safe its good enough. Most people sell their off road toys before they ever hit 5000 miles on them. How reliable do they really need to make them? Also, we the owners, are probably more to blame on most problems than the manufacturer. We beat the heck out of these things and complain if they brake, Ride, Repair, Repeat is the process for off road vehicles. Some are better than others, no doubt, but pretty much the higher the performance the more work its going to require to maintain. Manufactures are better off pushing the envelope of features and performance to get sales than they are to worry about quality (Polaris business model). Honda use to worry and still do to some point about building high quality first but they always suffered in performance because of it and lost sales.

If we built a list like OP stated it would be very long list and it would look like they all are junk. Pick what features are most important to you and deal with the negatives.
I would have to disagree with the price point argument ..here in Canada I鈥檓 paying 35,000 for an rmax with skid plate, bash plate, stereo, and adventure pro.. i paid 33,000 for my Dodge Ram sport that will run smooth and perfect with barely any issues for 300,000 kms.. and I do off road in them also.. these machines always have the same problems.. trannys, diffs, clutches, axles, ..few more with Polaris lol (owned a rzr for 5 years so I鈥檓 allowed to hack)..anyway it鈥檚 a lot of money is my point..and every year same story.. we will clearly pay insane money, just make the damn things stronger and a LITTLE more automotive like .. talking about all manufactures. Anyway that鈥檚 how I feel being in the sport a while spending boat loads of money riding SxS鈥檚
 

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We talked about this before and I agree. Paying a CRV price without heat/ac, windows/wipers, mirrors, stereo, heated seats, lane assist and airbags, a spare, insulation, and on and on.

That said... The thing is, Yamaha will probably sell 4k units in North America whereas Ram and CRV, that may be a days worth of sales. An RMax would be 50k to make it car like. It will never be as reliable.
I drifted my RMax the 1st km in it. Never tried that in my truck.

I know guys that paid more for a HD motorcycle than my 2016 Ram Sport.

Yamaha now has a 32k cruiser and the FJR and Super Tenere are basically 20k. 2 wheel machines with much less engineering involved.

This is where we are...

I would have to disagree with the price point argument ..here in Canada I鈥檓 paying 35,000 for an rmax with skid plate, bash plate, stereo, and adventure pro.. i paid 33,000 for my Dodge Ram sport that will run smooth and perfect with barely any issues for 300,000 kms.. and I do off road in them also.. these machines always have the same problems.. trannys, diffs, clutches, axles, ..few more with Polaris lol (owned a rzr for 5 years so I鈥檓 allowed to hack)..anyway it鈥檚 a lot of money is my point..and every year same story.. we will clearly pay insane money, just make the damn things stronger and a LITTLE more automotive like .. talking about all manufactures. Anyway that鈥檚 how I feel being in the sport a while spending boat loads of money riding SxS鈥檚
 

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We talked about this before and I agree. Paying a CRV price without heat/ac, windows/wipers, mirrors, stereo, heated seats, lane assist and airbags, a spare, insulation, and on and on.

That said... The thing is, Yamaha will probably sell 4k units in North America whereas Ram and CRV, that may be a days worth of sales. An RMax would be 50k to make it car like. It will never be as reliable.
I drifted my RMax the 1st km in it. Never tried that in my truck.

I know guys that paid more for a HD motorcycle than my 2016 Ram Sport.

Yamaha now has a 32k cruiser and the FJR and Super Tenere are basically 20k. 2 wheel machines with much less engineering involved.

This is where we are...
I get it..to my point I would actually pay the 50,000 if they made a truck quality side by side as capable as these machines are..I鈥檓 gonna reach 40,000 in no time anyway..the sport is evolving quick..
We talked about this before and I agree. Paying a CRV price without heat/ac, windows/wipers, mirrors, stereo, heated seats, lane assist and airbags, a spare, insulation, and on and on.

That said... The thing is, Yamaha will probably sell 4k units in North America whereas Ram and CRV, that may be a days worth of sales. An RMax would be 50k to make it car like. It will never be as reliable.
I drifted my RMax the 1st km in it. Never tried that in my truck.

I know guys that paid more for a HD motorcycle than my 2016 Ram Sport.

Yamaha now has a 32k cruiser and the FJR and Super Tenere are basically 20k. 2 wheel machines with much less engineering involved.

This is where we are...
I get it .. though my 2016 rzr 900s that I got for 16,000 and call it 20,000 all in with tires, lift, snorkels, springs and clutch kit...as much as I hack it was a beast..well at least I made it into a beast and I got over and through stuff I hope this rmax can do.. there鈥檚 no doubt Yamaha reliability is at the top.. But for the extra 15,000 all I鈥檓 saying is if you put my rzr beside the rmax would hold its own.. someone needs to just charge the money and make the machine to change the game. Nice pic of my rzr with the old done up rhino..if the rmax is anything like the rhino on steroids then we are in serious business that was the true bulletproof machine
90992
 

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They build these as cheap as they can get away with and sell them for what the market will bare. People will spend more on a toy then something they actually need. A top of the line ATV is now over 10k. People are running to buy an Rmax right now, knowing that in 6 months they could save 5 grand on it. It's a toy, you don't need it, you want it and they know it.
 
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Yamaha's had a few high profile issues with the last couple models:
-10cent drain clip leading to hydro-locked and ruined engines
-Poor engine assembly quality-control leading to dropped valves and ruined engines
-RMax's developing driveline issues

Honda
-Transmission issues

Polaris
-&$%^#Page is too large to be displayed or memory limitation error&%&*(&

Kawasaki
-KRX had bushing issues that were quickly addressed
-Poor finish in the door panelling pinches underside of the arm(pretty minor)

Canam
-
Can't say I've heard much other than they don't seem too worried about refinement as you often hear of heat and engine noise complaints in all their models


Personally, I don't like to rake a company over the coals for trying to release new and better products then potentially running into issues, such as what appears to be the case with the RMax driveline. To me it's more important how the company treats the people with these issues, and how they resolve the issue going forward.
That being said, other things like the drain clip issue in the X4 is inexcusable and the poor decision making process that leads to those decisions need to be identified and snuffed out immediately by the company.

What about Honda, have they addressed their transmission issues in recent models, or is that still dragging on?

What are everyone's thoughts, please add in other big known issues and comparisons. Number of occurrences is obviously a big factor also.
We're more familiar with Yamaha's, so we could nitpick them a bit easier/more unfairly.

To my knowledge, Kawasaki's launch of the KRX seems to have gone pretty well compared to failed drivelines and transmissions, or do they have bigger issues that I'm missing.
I have a 2019 Yamaha Wolverine X2 Rspec. What is the .10 cent drain clip you are referring too. Is it that small clip under the machine where some complained about oil puddling. If so, I replaced mine with a screw band. Is this the clip you are referring to ?


Thanks,

Pete
 

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Discussion Starter #35
I have a 2019 Yamaha Wolverine X2 Rspec. What is the .10 cent drain clip you are referring too. Is it that small clip under the machine where some complained about oil puddling. If so, I replaced mine with a screw band. Is this the clip you are referring to ?


Thanks,

Pete
Yes that's it, worm clamp is the quick effective fix for those of us that were lucky enough to spot it or read about via posts like Massive's. If you don't change it, the clip and drain cap can easily fall off allowing water to be sucked in as soon as your underbelly hits water.
 

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It's a toy and you do have to pay to play. You want the most reliable, then buy a Rhino or Mule. They won't be as fancy or as comfortable, but they are tanks. You can set them on fire, roll it down a hill and they would still run (thanks Joe Diffie). Point being the more complicated things get, the less reliable they are. Look at Jeeps and Broncos from yesteryear. They are tuff but how many of you would want to daily driver one? Now they are out of reach for most buyers ($$$) for playing but still as strong as they ever were. I still think its hard to beat Yamaha and Kawasaki for reliability today. Honda would be better off using the automotive 3 speed in the Pioneer 700 across the line. Polaris and Arctic Cat, I love that you guys are USA but get with the program. Especially Arctic Cat. They have freaking TextTron backing them. There should be no issue at all. At least with the XX they used Yamaha's engine. I do think they have the best suspension out of all manufactures. I guess I want a Yamaha engine, Wildcat suspension, Kawasaki chassis, Honda torque converter 3 speed transmission. Styling I'm up in the air. Sorry Can AM, you just aren't on my radar. I loved the commander but they are too hot inside and need an update which I think someone mentioned they are getting that or being discontinued.
 

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Those X3's are sweet, two just showed up on our local rides from guys that have ridden these trails for 15+ years, both coming from Can Am ATV's.
 
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Yes that's it, worm clamp is the quick effective fix for those of us that were lucky enough to spot it or read about via posts like Massive's. If you don't change it, the clip and drain cap can easily fall off allowing water to be sucked in as soon as your underbelly hits water.
Outstanding, thanks for the reply and I am glad I read about that here before it caused me problems. Great fourm to learn from others and to help each other.

Thanks
 

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I worked in military/space electronics for 40 years and there is nothing built that has more reliability engineering than the products we made for our guys in uniform. We beat the snot out of every single unit prior to shipping because they were mission critical and our soldier's lives might depend on it. It took years to bring a product to market for our customers due to all of the testing needed to qualify the unit and that it met the requirements of the contract. We baked, froze, shook, dropped, rained on everything we made. Some space hardware was left to burn-in for 12 months or more before they were stamped off by the customer's representative. Quality Assurance was so over the top at times it seemed silly and created many heated disagreements over the years. No expense was spared when it come to testing and ESS.

Did they break? Of course they did, with every precaution and expense taken to ensure they didn't... nothing is fail safe. There is not a single item manufactured that has 100% reliability especially when a new product line is released. That is always the goal but some things are out of your control and field testing is the only way to get them to rear their ugly heads. The computers and finite element analysis we have today allows designers to run simulations on piece parts and subassemblies long before any metal is cut. Sometimes the modeling would catch things the engineer overlooked and sometimes it didn't. I'm certain the analysis showed the wire clamp to be suitable to hold that plastic drain cap but on the trail, it wasn't. Real world testing is always the "last-word" when it comes to qualifying a product.

I'm convinced Yamaha will step up and fix all of these issues as they come up. Sure, it pisses you off when you lose your ride but that's just the way it is when you take a piece of machinery and push it beyond the limits it was designed for, something we're all guilty of at times. Add to that, it's what to expect when you buy a first model year. You assume the role of a product tester and I was willing to accept that when the check was written. I can only hope to keep this optimism if my tranny grenades in 50 miles.

Mike
 

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Yamaha's had a few high profile issues with the last couple models:
-10cent drain clip leading to hydro-locked and ruined engines
-Poor engine assembly quality-control leading to dropped valves and ruined engines
-RMax's developing driveline issues
Like others, I'm not sure I understand the point of your thread. The total number of units affected by these issues above is quite minimal.

  • You keep talking about the 10 cent drain clip. Do you know a lot of people with this issue?
  • What about the dropped valve? The engineering is fine. All companies have jagoffs that put stuff together wrong.
  • Finally, the transmission bearing on a 1st year unit...has affected very few so far.

Your post sounds like trolling as opposed to constructive feedback. I don't understand you bouncing around from thread to thread repeating rather inconsequential negativity.
 
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